Race Card: Egypt

Anonymous,

I don't think you are "defending" racism. I see you as providing some explanations for it, which the author of this article failed to do. Is this racism justified? Of course not! But it has to be understood in its context. The least that could have been done was raise the questions that you raised - why do AfAms identify Egyptians and not other African people.

Nadra,

I found the concluding sentence of yours very problematic.
"Perhaps it’s time for African Americans to learn more about how many people in the country they've romanticized hold them in such low regard."

You don't think that African Americans should learn how the system that enslaved them and continues to marginalize them, has impacted people in the 3rd world that has led to stagnation, deprivation e tc? And how this system continues to divide people who have much in common with each other and could join together to make things better for themselves. Instead, you recommend that they re-think this affinity because "those" people hold African Americans in low regard. At least the article that you refer to makes a one sentence mention that race relations have changed since Gamal Abdel-Nasser was president in 1966. You don't even acknowledge this. Do you know how problematic this is given how Arabs men are reviled, persecuted, considered uncivilized etc. in the US and Europe?

And you know what is even more problematic, the seeming lack of recognition that oppression can occur at multiple overlapping levels. Even the poor in the US are way better off than the poor in many Third World countries. I'm not sure what you or Khalid, for that matter, intend to convey - that the uncivilized uncouth Egyptian people are not worthy of democracy that they struggle for. That people of the First World, even if marginalized should not support them? Perhaps you did not intend for it to sound like this, but you realize that this is a sensitive issue, right? And many of us, third World people, are waiting with bated breaths at the outcome in these countries with uncivilized racist populations so that we can become more civilized. And we're hoping that unlike in countries like India, with its farce democracy, that Egypt and Tunisia will get it right - that it can finally shrug off imperial influences.

I come to Bitch to get a feminist analysis of cultural, social and political issues - one that is sensitive to kyriarchy. I'm sorry that this summary that was provided (because it would be a stretch to call it an analysis) gives me none of that.

Modern Egyptians are for the most part Arab, not black. I doubt even a significant amount are even mixed with Sub Saharan, so I'm not sure where you think most are.

As for black women being fetishized, I'm surprised pop culture hasn't been brought up in this article, hip hop videos are actually quite popular and viewed--those featuring and sexualizing black women-which is why I'm assuming Egyptian men behave this way and have a certain view of black women. This phenomenon is actually a little surprising, because in countries like India for example, sex is not what is thought of when a black woman shows up.

I've heard frequently from black people associating themselves with ancient Egypt, claiming Nefertiti "was obviously black" -even when she clearly does not have black features (high nose bridge, thin nose, full eyebrows, flat forehead). Same goes with the ancient art--which does depict black people differently than Arabs. I do think this stems from many African Americans thinking African=black, which is NOT the case

First of all, the Sub-saharan Africans need to understand that Egyptians consider themselves white or at least Arabs even though the majority are not Arabs except a few nomadic (Badwi) tribes who resided in Egypt migrating from the Arabian Peninsula. The Nubians who are real Africans are still in difficult situation and are oppressed to a certain point. Yet, the Nubians could have faced worse if they were not Muslims.
Having said that, I can't understand why African Americans or other Africans associate themselves with the past history of Egypt. There is no solid foundation for the claim that the ancient Egyptians (the Phraohs) were black or white. It looks like both whites and blacks are trying to prove that that history belonged to them. Of course, the whites will win at the end because they have the power, the media and also know better how to make forgeries. I have nothing against the white people but what I just said is the truth. The present and the future are more important than the past. So instead of wasting our time with what happened before thousands of years why don't we think about how to better ourselves today? I think, sometimes, it is not fair to blame those who see Africans and African Americans as people with less value. You don't need to look far to prove that; just, look the African countries situation. Dictators, young people dying in high seas while trying to reach Europe, tribes fighting against tribes. Worse that our leaders are involved in tribal war look at the Kenyan case against the president-Kenyatta, and Sudan-Omar Al-Bashir. Al-sisi coup d'état and the killing of thousands of innocent demonstrators will not result international crimes as the West agrees with him.
Being myself in the United States and having seen the African American situation, I can tell you that African Americans are in worse situation did not change that much from what it was 30 years ago. They are either in prison, alcoholic, killed by another African American, killed or harassed by a white police man, or are lazy when it comes to work. I was working with African Americans for the last 4 months. The job is real easy, you document, you do a less than one hour active work but the African Americans and even the Africans don't like to do that one hour work and be paid 8 hour shift. They come, sit and be on the phone in almost two thirds of the time they were supposed to work. They fill the documentation in the last 30 minutes. Someone could study, read books, or do some useful things to advance self while still doing this job and being paid. They listen rap music from their phones, or text, or look into websites for shopping. We can't generalize because I have also seen very decent people who are hard workers and strive to better self.
The brother who wrote the article did not specify if his wife was Bantu or Somaali faradheer. what I know is that there are thousands of Somalis living in Egypt and they never complained about deep racism. True, here and there will be times when you will meet with someone who will hate you of who you are but the majority of he Egyptians don't discriminate against the Somalis. That is what I was at least told by those Somalis who lived there but someone who was there knows better than me.
I, personally, have not been in Arab countries but I met a few of them here in the United States. Unfortunately, those I met are not the arrogant Arabs I heard about such Saudis. I met Palestinians, Syrians, and Iraqis and they did not show any discrimination against me.
Any way, it is true that Arabs are racist in general. But how about the Black Africans being racist to each other based on tribe or wealth? How about slavery of Bantus among themselves? True, Africans slaves other African and worse that they kill them for money.
My advice to African Americans is to forget about Egypt and also about Africa and do well in the United States. Help your people to be out of jail, not be become drug addicted, and not alcohol addicted (by the way, the liquor stores out number the grocery stores in the African American areas.) Educate your people.

Well, there is a revolution going on, for democracy. Be aware that most non-democratic regimes in the world are kept in place by US imperialism.

Egyptians of all genders, classes, ages, etc. are in the streets RIGHT NOW, fighting for their rights, for human rights, for democracy, against poverty and imperialism.

The Mubarak regime is backed by US imperialism, the army and police there are funded by US government and US private companies. Tear gas used to repress the people was made in the US.

Your comment was so patronizing.

I am Kenyan which is in East Africa. Egyptians were never black, always arabs. Yes, they did come in contact with Nubians (modern Sudanese) but that does not mean they are of mixed race. A few maybe. But they are still largely of arab descent. African-americans should stop acting like Egypt is the only country they can identify with. They are 54 African countries on the continent. Not all Africans are black, north African is inhabited by arabs and always has been.

African-Americans came from West Africa, and Egypt is in North East Africa, very far from where you all came from. There were great empires of Ashanti, Yoruba, Ibo, Mandinka people. To the east, Nubian and Ethiopian history is also very rich. Just because the media portrays black Africa as a place plagued by poverty and hunger does not mean a rich history never existed in these countries. Not all Africans are poor, the rich and middle class also exist in these countries. So stop claiming the only history romanticized by white people, and find out the "true" history of your own people. Arab people also enslaved people from East Africa, mostly women and children who were sold as concubines in the middle east. That is why they are people of African descent in Iraq, Iran, India, Pakistan, Saudi Arabia and a lot of countries in Asia. Yes, North Africans are racist towards black people because they see them as slaves (women as sex slaves). The East African slavery is rarely talked about, but it happened for hundreds of years. Think about that when you are romanticizing about people that think you are inferior to them. Modern slavery still continues - it involves Sudanese girls sold into the arab world. Read the book "Slave" by Mende Nazer and learn something.

So, does a Native American have the right to claim Aztec culture as their own?

THis is a more correct analogy than yours since Egypt is much newer and distant geographically than the ancient African kingdoms of Subsaharan Africa.

Seriously, look into how big Africa is. Subsaharan African culture does not equal Ancient Egyptian culture. Africa hosts the most genetic diversity in the world in its continent which is HUGE. The two most diverse human genomes exist within Africa. Skin color is a poor linkage in identifying a history of a people. However, I agree that praising Egypt as an example of epic African culture which became a center for trade, learning and international is fine. But coming from Liberia and claiming ancient Egypt is the history of all Africans, that it's somehow YOUR history because your skin is Black is a stretch. It's almost as incorrect as an Arab claiming Asiatic peoples infused Egypt with its magnificent history because undoubtedly, Arab people living outside Africa mixed with early African Egyptians. I mean with that logic, Africans can claim credit for all advances in Human history because we all came from there. Please.